A Further Thought on the ‘Who Created…’ Game

It is the case that if the atheist seriously mounts the “Well then, who (or what) caused God?” objection against theism, then the theist can just as readily mount the “Well then, who (or what) caused the universe?” objection against the atheist; and it should be pointed out that this game is much worse for the atheist than the theist, for while it is easy and natural to demand a cause for the universe–there does not, after all, seem to be anything necessary about the universe’s existence–the fact is that it is absurd to ask for the cause of a being which must, by definition, be uncaused in order for the being to be what it is (for God, to be the greatest conceivable being, which He is, must be uncaused, for all other things being equal, an uncaused being is greater than a caused one) and thus while it makes sense to ask for a cause of the universe, it does not make sense to do so for God.

Advertisements

14 thoughts on “A Further Thought on the ‘Who Created…’ Game

  1. How does it not make sense to ask for a cause for god? Why must you ask for a cause for the universe? The difference between atheists and theists is we CANT leave any unexplained up to a supreme being, but that being said unlike most theists were not scared to admit we dont know yet. I disagree with the argument of whether there is or is not a god at all. I believe what i believe because all of the claims and stories about a god are too contradictory. Because if their is a god theres too much he should be able to do and either he chooses not to or he doesnt exist, this being why i choose to believe and HOPE there is no such thing as a god. Im sure you too have your reasoning, though your statements here dont make much sense to me. IF something is then their is reason, nothing is unreasonable.

    Like

  2. So, apart from claiming that the biblical god is ‘necessary’, what evidence or demonstration do you have for his actual existence?
    Arguments are not evidence

    Like

    • KIA,

      Based on your last comment (namely, ‘Arguments are not evidence’) you have shown yourself to be too short for this ride. Try to think about why and then get back to me (Hint: Without an argument arguing for what the best explanation of the evidence is, evidence in and of itself is meaningless and useless…a fingerprint, in and of itself, is useless, for only when it is argued that the best explanation of that fingerprint is due to a robbery (whatever) does the fingerprint point in a specific direction. Lawyer don’t just present fingerprint or DNA or testimony is a court, they present those things and then argument that those facts are best explained by one version of events rather than another. So claiming that you want evidence(TM) and not arguments is, quite frankly, stupid.)

      Like

      • might be hard to get back to someone who isn’t courteous or perhaps courageous enough to use a name, link an email or a blog address. till then you are welcome to comment on my blog, have a great new years

        Like

      • KIA,

        Sometimes the truth is harsh, but truth it is nonetheless. And sometimes that truth needs to be said with a little bit of bite in order to get through. The fact is that your comment was foolish and nonsensical, and I pointed that out to you. You may not like it, but that’s not my problem, it’s yours. Either way, I hope to have you back, but regardless, have a good New Year as well.

        Like

      • the truth is that arguments only seek to explain facts and evidence. they are explanations, they are not the evidence themselves.

        Like

      • Yes, I know. But to essentially ask for ‘Evidence, not Arguments’, which is what you did, is nonsensical, for a fact or observation can only count as evidence for something (such as the existence of God) if an argument is presented which shows that the fact or observation should be considered evidence for the explanation in question. So again, asking for evidence for God but not arguments–which, again, is essentially what you did–makes no sense, for presenting evidence for God must be done in the context of an argument. Thus, the foolish atheist meme of demanding ‘evidence, not arguments’ is, essentially, stupidity.

        Like

      • amazingly rude to people who disagree with you. might want to examine that in the light of what scripture says about the tongue (james 3 and ephesians 4)

        Like

      • KIA,

        I might add that all arguments–or at least all a posteriori arguments–contain evidence (or facts) within them. So again, asking for evidence but not arguments is simply nonsense.

        Like

      • KIA,

        Stop with the ‘not very Christian’ bullshit, as if attempts at “shaming” will work here. We are after the truth, not happy feelings. If you don’t like it, don’t stay.

        Like

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s